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Post by soonerlongbow on Feb 10, 2016 3:55:13 GMT -6
If North Korea can put a satellite in outer space it seems COE should be able to manage water. Well....... maybe not. As an old MP, my intraserve rivalry runs deep with the Castle (even into family). Yeah, I'm really not surprised at all. The face of CoE that we see every day are guys and gals in civilian attire, but make no mistake about it: it's the Army! Of The Troops And For The Troops!!!
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Post by Fenwick on Feb 10, 2016 9:34:53 GMT -6
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Post by paul01 on Feb 10, 2016 10:47:53 GMT -6
You can have the best water flow models in the universe, but at the end of the day, the only thing that matters is the course of action that is taken based on the results. Therein lies the problem.
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Post by Aaron on Feb 10, 2016 11:44:13 GMT -6
Park is open. Just hung up with Eddie. He was on the EH bridge watching one of the first EH fishers net 2 fish. The early bird...
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Post by mirvc17 on Feb 10, 2016 12:00:36 GMT -6
That is good news. Didn't think it would be open so quickly. Still on the African continent a bit longer. And my Montana plans are almost solid--there's a good chance I may run into "7WT" while I'm there. ;-)
I hope I don't get addicted to flash.
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Post by woscholar on Feb 10, 2016 12:34:36 GMT -6
Park is open. Just hung up with Eddie. He was on the EH bridge watching one of the first EH fishers net 2 fish. The early bird... Does that mean all of the camping as well? Nothing is posted on the BBSP Facebook site yet.
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Post by bradbessett on Feb 10, 2016 13:22:31 GMT -6
It was probably Branson throwing a tandem Rat-L-Trap rig.
Excited to hear some reports form the field!
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Post by Fenwick on Feb 10, 2016 13:33:59 GMT -6
Who'll be the first to post a fishing report with photos for Feb. 10, 2016?
I imagine the fly shop guides, the park concessions, the log home rentals and the merchants out on 259 are pleased.
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Post by texanfisherman on Feb 10, 2016 13:43:42 GMT -6
I'll be there early Friday morning! Last week I applied for pre-approval for a fishing trip this weekend. My request was approved.
I hope the river isn't packed.
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Post by woscholar on Feb 10, 2016 13:50:34 GMT -6
I'll be there early Friday morning! Last week I applied for pre-approval for a fishing trip this weekend. My request was approved. I hope the river isn't packed. Glad your wife approved the trip.
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Post by woscholar on Feb 10, 2016 13:54:08 GMT -6
Who'll be the first to post a fishing report with photos for Feb. 10, 2016? I imagine the fly shop guides, the park concessions, the log home rentals and the merchants out on 259 are pleased. I'm expecting more pics like this one for now:
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Post by golferjeff on Feb 10, 2016 14:13:14 GMT -6
Packed? If the word is getting out, it is going to be a madhouse. I may brave the masses if I can find a trip buddy.
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Post by ericb on Feb 10, 2016 15:08:09 GMT -6
I'll be there at dawn's early light on Friday. It just so happens that I'm off that day. I'll only have a few hours to fish before I have to run some errands in Texarkana. I'm going to do a little fishing there too. I'm also off on Monday for President's Day so you can bet I'll fish all day then!!!
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Post by Fenwick on Feb 10, 2016 19:14:36 GMT -6
You can have the best water flow models in the universe, but at the end of the day, the only thing that matters is the course of action that is taken based on the results. Therein lies the problem. There's an app for that! Somewhere...anyone? Hello Corps?
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Post by jonbo on Feb 10, 2016 21:32:19 GMT -6
What could they have done differently? The entire Red River Basin was flooded for weeks. Highway bridges were shut down. The Corps was forced to dump the equivalent of the Mississippi at St Louis (at least so someone said around here) into Spillway Creek for days. Having shutdown the generators, or whatever they're called, for repairs, I'm pretty sure had little or nothing to do with the subsequent flooding. They managed to protect the public all the way downstream. The Park suffered. Small loss in the grand scheme, I'm sorry.
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Post by okieman71 on Feb 10, 2016 22:46:14 GMT -6
I do not disagree. However, If there is no way or plan of action to prevent future occurrences like the two floods of 2015, then what is the point of restoring the EH or any other part of the park. I know that the scenario we had in 2015 is rare but 2009 messed up everything as well. I would love to go back to the EH & Lost Creek pre-flood. It was great but I have to wonder is there a better course of action?? I don't guess there is anything they could do in the park that would add habitat and withstand major floods. Just curious
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Post by dainw on Feb 11, 2016 8:52:15 GMT -6
What exactly would a plan of action to prevent future flooding occurrences entail? There's no way to control how much rain we get and since we're keeping in mind that the COE has to manage water levels at reservoirs downstream of broken bow lake as well, they can't exactly just crank up the generators every time the lake starts creeping up into the flood pool. I think the May flood could have been avoided to a degree, by not scheduling maintenance on the generator during rainy season. This recent flood I think was probably a function of the lakes still being high from all the spring rains, but that flooding was endemic to the entire region. Look at the white river below bull shoals lake, they're still releasing 30,000 CFS through the dam there.
That being said, you may have a point. I'm not sure how prudent it is to to "repair" the evening hole, at least to the extent it was pre-May flood. Personally, I'm of the opinion that flooding like this will start to become quite a bit more frequent in the future. Hopefully they have the foresight to do whatever is necessary to remove the silt accumulation in the lower EH, which is a prime spawning area, Beyond that, I'm not sure how much more conservation work is necessary. Personally, I'd prefer that the powers that be green light the project to clean out the low flow pipes in the re-reg dam so that zone III is fishable year round.
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Post by paul01 on Feb 11, 2016 10:21:48 GMT -6
I don't claim to be an expert on water management, but from my "armchair" view, my guess would be that some of the lakes in the region need to be kept at lower water levels - all the time. Flood control pools are clearly not fail-safe constructs.
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Post by bradbessett on Feb 11, 2016 10:51:13 GMT -6
Hard to do when the region is in a state of drought 90% of the time. The water they have had to deal with this year has been a monumental undertaking and this fishery is on the very bottom of their priority list. I'm just glad they at least gave Eddie enough notification this time.
Besides, this saga is hopefully past us for good. Let's get to talking about the awesome new shop we are going to have and how excellent the fishing is going to be.
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Post by schrederman on Feb 11, 2016 11:09:00 GMT -6
I agree that the pre-flood Evening Hole and Lost Creek were beautiful, but there's no telling how this will all shake out. I haven't seen the Spillway Creek, yet, other than the drone fly-overs, but it looks tons better than it was. If and when Evening Hole gets repaired and made better, the river as a whole will be better than before. As dedicated as many of you are, you'll get to witness and enjoy this transformation, first hand. Let's all just hope something like this doesn't happen again in the foreseeable future, and that my health stays good enough that I can be there for that, too. Look for us Sunday evening. I'll be up on the river with my 2 grown sons, and I'd love to meet some of you. They're leaving Tuesday night but I'll be there on Wednesday until the afternoon...
Jack Womack
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Post by Aaron on Feb 11, 2016 14:43:57 GMT -6
bradbessett, they didn't give Eddie any heads up as we would have liked. At 2:30 am he got the call that they were going to open the gates. So do the math, they gave him essentially no notice. We were watching the flows very closely the weeks prior since it was nearing the same levels as the May levels. The day prior, I called Eddie, and Jim Miller (the head of the park)was with him. Neither Eddie, nor Jim, were aware of the increasing inflows to the lake. Looking at the radar, forecast, and other models we thought it might be prudent to get a head start on getting most of the stuff out. The shop was partially cleared of inventory at 6pm... 8 hours later, he got the call... Where I thought there was poor management from the Corp was the decisions to keep other lakes that were 20-25 feet from the top of their spillways fully open. For example, Pine Creek was 23 feet from topping, Hugo was 21 feet from topping and both were releasing heavy flows. Broken Bow Lake was 10 feet from topping the Spillway with significantly more inflow. If they had looked at the models correctly, they would have seen the indications of massive inflow to the drainage basin and the need for the shift of release. My career dictates that I understand weather and can read forecasts and models. Otherwise you would be flying into Thunderstorms and adverse weather all the time as a passenger. I'm not a Corp engineer (however I feel overqualified from their past actions), but it was very apparent what needed to be done. Instead they delayed the shifting of releases for 18-19 hours. Do the math and you will find that such a dramatic water release from Broken Bow would most likely have been avoided (maybe less that May, maybe close). I've tried to keep quite silent on criticizing because the Corp has been working pretty hard to help Eddie get everything approved in a more timely manner. However, the way the situation developed needs to be addressed. There is an element of nature we cannot control, but the Corp should be proactive not reactive.
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Post by Fenwick on Feb 11, 2016 16:01:17 GMT -6
Aaron, thank you for the back story on this situation we've been guessing at in armchair quarterback fashion. Moving on to the shop...are the guides being booked despite the new shop not yet in existence? Seems nothing more than phone call arrangements to meet at a particular lot at a particular time are required though it might be problematic if last minute items are needed. Just wondering.
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Post by soonerlongbow on Feb 11, 2016 16:32:32 GMT -6
Who'll be the first to post a fishing report with photos for Feb. 10, 2016? I imagine the fly shop guides, the park concessions, the log home rentals and the merchants out on 259 are pleased. I'm expecting more pics like this one for now: That's pretty much how I fish, fly or spin, rivers or still waters! Lots of stick bass.
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Post by Fenwick on Feb 16, 2016 21:29:17 GMT -6
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Post by texanfisherman on Feb 17, 2016 8:34:17 GMT -6
So I'm pretty sure I know what YYYYYYYY and XXXXXXX are. Hopefully the fish can stay at YYYYYYYYYYYY for many years. I sure did enjoy fishing XXXXXXXXXX the other day.
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