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Post by turfdawg on Feb 22, 2017 19:09:44 GMT -6
Just wondering everyone's opinion on how close is too close. Let's face it, this place just keeps getting more popular. I know we all like wide open fishing but it is getting harder to find open spots where there is a good distance between people. I don't want to make anyone mad but I do not want to drive then sit on the bank waiting either.
Guides, when you have a client how close will you put them to a stranger?
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Post by mirvc17 on Feb 22, 2017 20:03:11 GMT -6
Turfdawg,
That's an excellent question and I bet there will be a bunch of answers. I'm no guide, but I'll give my opinion since you asked.
IMO, I try to give another angler as much room as I possibly can. What does that mean? I'll get to that in a second.
I remember listening to Tom Rosenbauer saying something like that if he even saw another angler, he'd keep walking until they were completely out of sight and then some. I laughed because we don't have that luxury most of the time.
That being said, I think it depends on just how busy the river you're fishing is too. I think avoiding a particular stretch of water or a pool or run that someone else is clearly working is good advice. I'd also leave them with some space to move up or down too. Ask them if they are working up or down stream. The big thing is to ask someone if they mind if you step in and fish. What bothers me is if someone steps into the same pool I am working, or if they are essentially within my casting distance. The worst is someone that doesn't ask or say anything and just starts fishing right next to you.
In Alaska it could be awful during salmon season because a lot of people have virtually no etiquette. Either they don't care, or they don't know. You might be fishing for rainbows, but they just assume you're flipping for reds like everyone else and come walking right through where you're fishing....or clean their fish right there, or any number of other things that ruin the experience.
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Post by breeden3 on Feb 22, 2017 21:48:42 GMT -6
I certainly never put my clients within casting distance of someone. I also generally ask if we are going to be close. However, the LMF is different as well in that it is super crowded and there isn't much water to fish. If someone is fishing a hole, I will give them that hole and then just go on up to the next good spot. There may be several good holes in a 30 yard stretch of water but the way the river is, one person can't fish every hole. I generally see people getting along and not having many problems with it this way. Now where I guide in CO, people would bust your car windows and slash your tires for jumping in that close. Tailwaters are just a little different due to high traffic and in all likelihood less fishable water.
If I see another guide on the water, I won't even personally fish anywhere near them, because I know what it means to have as much fishable water as possible, but that is guide to guide.
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Post by paul01 on Feb 22, 2017 23:04:30 GMT -6
This is a really good question that deserves some discussion. I'm not a Guide, but on other rivers that are heavily fished, my "rule of thumb" is that your fly should never hit the same spot as the adjacent angler, which for all practical purposes, means that you should be at a separation of at least 60 feet if you are fishing for trout. This also means that if you are the latest arrival and are wading from the opposite bank, you should never cast your fly to the same spot as someone who was there first. An exception would be if the other angler (or myself) asked for permission to fish in close proximity and the request was granted (I ALWAYS say yes when I'm asked). Otherwise, as Peter pointed out, the amount of fishable water in the LMF is scant, so I don't expect conventional rules to apply. My approach: Ignore trespasses of etiquette as long as there is no safety hazard, meaning that if someone arrives after me and has positioned themselves where they are in danger of being hooked when I back cast, I politely ask them to move for their own safety.
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Post by golferjeff on Feb 23, 2017 8:37:03 GMT -6
Beavers Bend - I would never step in within another person's drift. That usually means about 50-60 feet if they are tossing nymphs. Streamers need a little more room since you are tossing across or downstream and stripping back. The only caveat I have to that is if I know the person or group and then I ask if I can fish alongside them. That seems to happen a lot on the LMF.
Western Tailwaters - Ask nicely if you are going to be fishing the same pool or long riffle. PLaces like the Taylor C&R or the Dream Stream can be about the same as the LMF in terms of crowds. Lesser tailwaters or more remote tailwaters I try to stay out of the same area. No need since there are probably less than a dozen people fishing it.
Western Freestones - If I see another person, I keep moving. Same with mountain creeks, and with those, I may even pack up and go a mile or two up or down stream to get away from them.
Also - at LMF, I sometimes ask if I can cast to a certain fish if it is a little too close to just step in. As long as the guys nearby aren't actively fishing to it.
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Post by Fenwick on Feb 23, 2017 13:14:47 GMT -6
In my younger days in NJ the trout fishing was like that on the Evening Hole on a perfectly nice weekend, close quarters and sometimes crossed lines. When I got a little older and went to the Catskills and to south central Pa. I often had a 1/4 mile or more between fishermen. Sweet. I prefer minimum distance between myself and the next fisherman up or downstream of me that there's room for us to cast, catch fish, spook fish and move 75 ft. up or down without getting in each others way. My usual fishing buddy is way more tolerant of close quarters and easily places himself between two guys 30 ft. apart and having no luck, lands a few in front of them within five minutes if that and then moves on leaving them dumbfounded. I gotta have my space which made Zone 2 nice back in the day.
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Post by okieman71 on Feb 23, 2017 13:42:34 GMT -6
Whats sad is the potential for quite a bit more fishable water is a real possibility. However, the powers that be probably don't see it that way. I may be way off on what I am about to say but oh well. It has been in the plans in the past to clean out the Re-Reg dam. That brings a question to my mind. Is it really serving a purpose? Why not just get rid of the re-reg dam?? Demolish it and ZII would or at least should have much more fishable water. That re-reg lake is about 2.5 miles of ZII. Secondly, there has been talk of going down deeper in the lake to pump colder water than they are currently. I know there would be mega costs associated with those endeavors. However, the LMF and beavers bend is not what it was 20 years ago. In addition, the fly fishing community brings in quite a bit of revenue to the area and that is year around. It would make sense to create as much fishable water as possible. So much wasted potential due to a lack of concern or vision at the top. I guess a guy can dream about having 9-12 miles of fishable trout water in Oklahoma. Still a pity what happened to spillway creek. That was one cool mile of water. Sorry for hi-jacking the thread but thought that this tied in to the conversation fairly well.
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Post by golferjeff on Feb 24, 2017 8:31:18 GMT -6
Spillway creek fishes better now than it did pre-flood. You just have to work at it and it isn't manufactured. The full 1.25 miles is still fishable. IT just isn't pool/run/pool any more. My dog hates it because of the jagged bedrock, but ask the good anglers and they will tell you it holds more fish than ever. OKie - where are you getting that they are pumping warmer water? Remember, this is a COE project, not a state of OKlahoma project. Tyler's studies have shown the water temperature is just fine from spillway all the way to zone II. Any yes, the re-reg project is dead. No money is being diverted there. Back on thread..... anyone willing to walk the extra 1/4 mile can usually find a less crowded spot. Middle spillway, hickory, and lower day use are good examples. I realize some/many cannot make that trek, which is why EH and upper spillway are so jammed up. LMF is just a different animal. Common sense goes a long way, but that is asking too much for some people. Too close for me is being able to hear other people's conversations (But I'm partially deaf )
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How Close
Feb 24, 2017 8:54:37 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by hankinsfly on Feb 24, 2017 8:54:37 GMT -6
I always give people lots of room and I watch to see the technique they're using. If they are swinging streamers or wet flies, obviously they need lots of room downstream. Dead-drifting, just any good piece of water is theirs within reason. On big, wide sections of river, it's a little different. There are lots of people who deserve to fish too, so I need to be reasonable with what's acceptable to me. If someone asks me to fish near me, I'll tell to come on in, tell me how your day has gone. But if someone just barges on in close to me without asking, I'll have to take measures to make them know they are too close. Respect and courtesy go a long way. I fish alone frequently and I've had people fishing close to me offer to take pictures of a good fish I caught, which is really good of them. Now, crappie fishing from the bank? Different story. Come on in and get em!
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Post by okieman71 on Feb 24, 2017 9:38:29 GMT -6
Jeff, I never said they were pumping warmer water. I said there has been talk of them going deeper into the reservoir to get colder water. Probably just a rumor. While temps in ZI may be fine, ZII & III temps in July and August are not. I have no problem with how Spillway fishes now but I did like it better pre-flood. Just my opinion. I also do not mind walking as I do it quite often. My point was if they are going to create more fishable water it would obviously have to happen by making some changes in ZII & III. Prolly will never happen.
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Post by jonbo on Feb 24, 2017 12:33:19 GMT -6
I imagine it's all about finding the very scarce funding for the projects mentioned. I'm just happy that they're going to all the trouble to fix the EH back up. About the "modern" SC, I don't like it, but that's only because it's awfully hard for me to haul my old, stiff body around on those jagged rocks. I believe Jeff when he says that it holds more fish than ever, but how do I reach them? It's been many years since I could make like Evan and bounce around out there like a human cork.
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